User:Madkatmaximus/ChatLogs/11 July 2015

 [11:39]  Can you still upload and print them if they're on a disc? [11:39]  Well you want to walk through some London? [11:39]  You'd have to get them from the disc to the computer, but yes. [11:39]  That would be hard [11:40]  I've read the bible cover to cover [11:40]  This one person has cancer in the movie. :c [11:40]  Which is why i said I've never come across a prophecy that came true [11:40]  You know the goal of Messiah prophecy? Let's start there [11:40]  I kinda have to have an online site, because I use my photos a lot. Editing, printing, etc etc [11:41]  gotcha. Thought you meant as a backup in case something happened. [11:41]  urgh I need Luke to help me in this discussion :P he's my backup theology person XD but he's at a youth group thingy tonight. [11:41]  Let's start with the first prophecy in the Bible. Anyone wanna guess first? :P [11:42]  In isaiah (derp) [11:42]  Farther back :P [11:42]  I would say something but i don't want to start something. :p [11:42] <Chrismajor2124> Hey it's a safe place. Go ahead [11:42] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> It's already started [11:42] <Michaelyoda> ^ [11:42] <Michaelyoda> Merely warming up. :P [11:43] <TolkienNerds> there was prophesy stuff in the Samuels but I'm not sure if those were the first ones :P [11:43] <RusMan> Ugh all because Im watching this movie and mentioned it :p [11:43] <Chrismajor2124> Anyone want to stab at the first prophecy for the Messiah? Its further back [11:43] <Michaelyoda> Genesis. (derp) [11:43] <RusMan> Genesis [11:43] <TolkienNerds> XD [11:43] <Chrismajor2124> Boom [11:43] <Michaelyoda> Sheesh people. :P [11:43] <Michaelyoda> Don't make me answer all the questions. (ud) [11:43] <RusMan> When god said that the snake would bruise jesus heal [11:43] <RusMan> But he would crush the serpants head (derp) [11:44] <Chrismajor2124> So we have the Garden of Eden. Sin enters the world, Adam and Eve basically destroy mankind's future. And as RusMan said, Genesis 3:15 [11:44] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> Thanks Eve [11:44] <Chrismajor2124> Yeah :P [11:44] <Chrismajor2124> I agree on that one :P [11:44] <Michaelyoda> But most women would be quick to point out that Adam was right there and didn't do anything. (derp) [11:45] <Michaelyoda> "Thanks Adam." :P [11:45] <Chrismajor2124> Thanks both of them :P [11:45] <Mishkaiel> stupid people (UD) [11:45] <RusMan> Not necessarily :p [11:45] <TolkienNerds> guys this isn't relevant to the current conversation but LOOK https://scontent-atl1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpt1/v/t1.0-9/11665784_1607161852902571_4854900781206981717_n.jpg?oh=3f89d653afbc1aefe5b894c5af061baa&amp;oe=565BC6FD [11:45] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> That's true, usually women require constant supervision [11:45] <Mishkaiel> * Mishkaiel throws them both out window [11:45] <Mishkaiel> PER LONDON [11:45] <Michaelyoda> (XD) [11:45] <Mishkaiel> PER PER PER PER LONDON [11:45] <TolkienNerds> I object london :P [11:45] <TolkienNerds> we do not [11:45] <TolkienNerds> we are perfectly capable [11:45] <RusMan> You know that the garden of eden was probably pretty large :p [11:45] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> I hope Luke is up to the task, Tolk. :P [11:45] <Chrismajor2124> First prophecy ever - the seed of the snake (Satan basically) against the Seed of the woman. Not to sound weird but women don't carry the main genetics for a baby. This automatically sounds like a supernatural birth because it defies basic biology. So far, the guy who crushes the serpent has to be a human being not born like a human being [11:45] <RusMan> So hr may not have bee. With her right that second :p [11:46] <TolkienNerds> Lukey seems to be doing pretty well so far XD [11:46] <Chrismajor2124> And this went straight to Feminism issues :P [11:46] <RusMan> :p [11:47] <Michaelyoda> :P [11:47] <Michaelyoda> Sorry (derp) [11:47] <Chrismajor2124> Ah no prob. :P [11:47] <Chrismajor2124> So let's jump quickly to Abraham shall we? :P [11:47] <Indigo~> okay nevermind I just used up the rest of our bandwidth trying to upload them online. I need to put them on a disc [11:47] <Indigo~> :p [11:47] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> How can that prophecy be true if it hasn't been proven correct? [11:47] <Chrismajor2124> Well should we prove that one first? [11:48] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> I was referring to the Genesis one we were talking about [11:48] <Chrismajor2124> Let's prove that one [11:48] <TolkienNerds> o/ [11:49] <Felldohir> \o [11:49] <Chrismajor2124> Jump to Mary in Luke 1 and 2 (I think those are the chapters). An angel visits her and tells her she will give birth to the Messiah and within a few weeks she is pregnant with Jesus. She's not married so this is obviously a scam or a supernatural birth. [11:49] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> You can have a baby without getting married [11:49] <Chrismajor2124> Then go to Matthew 1, where Joseph and Mary are engaged [11:50] <Michaelyoda> It's also noted that Mary is a virgin [11:50] <Chrismajor2124> Joseph finds out she is pregnant and the law of the time says he can break off the engagement if she committed adultry. But Joseph marries her anyways, thus protecting her from the law [11:50] <Chrismajor2124> Yeah, she was a virgin, now pregnant. Either she slept around, or "that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit" [11:51] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> What proved that Mary was a virgin? [11:51] <Chrismajor2124> The Bible affirms the second one [11:51] <Chrismajor2124> Tokens of virginity - basically, physical and testimonial evidence that Mary had been a virgin all her life [11:51] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> Can you link me the sources of this evidence? [11:51] <Chrismajor2124> And Biblical witness - Luke states she was a virgin [11:52] <Chrismajor2124> Yeah, go to http://www.bible.com and look up Luke and Matthew [11:52] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> Just because someone says something is true doesn't mean it is [11:52] <Chrismajor2124> Specifically the first few chapters [11:52] <Chrismajor2124> Now that's an argument for the validity of the Bible. We can go there but that's another subject :P [11:52] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> And I'm talking about secular evidence. The bible isn't evidence of God's existence, it's the claim of God's existence. [11:52] <Chrismajor2124> You know the difference between proof and evidence? [11:53] <TolkienNerds> oh wow okay I leave for 2 minutes and bam there's a lot of conversation :P [11:53] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> Proof is stronger than evidence. [11:53] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> The Bible is neither proof nor evidence. [11:53] <Chrismajor2124> Evidence is a sign that something may have happened. For instance, if you wear a hat and we find a hat at a crime scene, it's possible proof you were there [11:53] <Chrismajor2124> Evidence is undeniable truth that something happened. For instance, a DNA test will prove that the DNA found is yours [11:54] <Chrismajor2124> Biblical prophecy does that. In Isaiah 46, God challenges all "gods" and people and even Satan to prove that He isn't who He says He is [11:55] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> Except if you're claiming you are the one and only God, it's up to you to support it with evidence because you're the one stating the claim. The burden of proof lies with the affirmative [11:56] <Chrismajor2124> Well here's a bit from Isaiah 46 where He adresses the burden of proof [11:56] <Chrismajor2124> In verse 9 and 10, He says "Remember the former things of old (history) For I am God and there is no other, I am God, and there is none like Me, declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things that are not yet done, saying 'My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure." [11:57] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> When has he ever shown us the future? [11:57] <Chrismajor2124> And thus, the Bible - God's communication with humanity [11:57] <Chrismajor2124> For instance, the Messiah is a great example. Eschatology is one that affects us the most [11:58] <RusMan> Revelation talks about the future. [11:58] <Chrismajor2124> The first prophecy of the Messiah from Genesis is an estimated 1000+ years before Jesus was born. 1000 if you start with Moses writing it down, nearly 4000 if you count oral tradition [11:58] <Chrismajor2124> Revelation is a PERFECT example of prophecy [11:58] <Chrismajor2124> Declaring the end before it happens [11:59] <LondonDauntlessCorvair963> Jesus was the one claiming he was the Messiah. That doesn't prove that the prophecy came true. It should be obvious that somebody would claim to be the Messiah, even if there was gonna be a Messiah. [11:59] <Chrismajor2124> There's the Fourfold witness